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Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Discoman on Wed Aug 12, 2009 3:18 pm

alex wrote:Poor Le if he has to read this all.

one must hope he isn't. wow has this conversation evolved dramatically.
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wtf

Post  alex on Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:02 pm

if it would be my forum then I would destroy all sings that it ever existed Smile And then create a new one and hope it would be ok now pale

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Feeding the troll

Post  Guest on Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:16 am

I'm sorry everyone for being the one who keeps these flames running.
I suggest everyone (including myself) just ignore v's rants on racism, sexism, and anything that's not robot related discussion.
I have PMed Aiko (Le Trung) asking for an ignore feature that would lock out guest posting.
Until such a feature arrives, we should all just ignore his posts.

Artilects_rule!

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Aiko on Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:15 am

This topic has a nice piece of a robot hand made from someone who work very hard, please keep it on topic...
BTW, you need to registrar to post now.....
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Artilects rule! on Thu Aug 13, 2009 12:52 pm

Aiko wrote:This topic has a nice piece of a robot hand made from someone who work very hard, please keep it on topic...
BTW, you need to registrar to post now.....
I wish this didn't have to happen at all.
I liked the old format where I didn't have to go to my E-mail each time to look up my password.
I guess it would've happen sooner or later, it always does.
Kthomp06 wrote:Here's the first stage of my project it has sence been modifed. I'm putting 3 servo's into each finger at a wieght of 1.5 oz. A hand can be from 250 to 500 grams(1lb) so I have room to modify. Don't wory about the size it's getting smaller. This is bone and muscel put together.

[img][/img]
There's some stuff in the medical community you could use too, only it would cost much more.

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Thu Aug 13, 2009 3:20 pm

Well I kind of knew that some thing was going to give here. Thank you Le. While some people have been bashing the otherís Iíve been hard at work trying to make a ring gear the size of an aspirin. As some people may know ring gears have vertical teeth not horizontal teeth. Iíve modified my magnifying glasses from 3x to 6x so I could see the little bugger. I had to build a tool to try and put teeth on at right angels to the gear. Iíve tried many different methods to do this (dremiling, filing, hobby saws, X-acto knives) none seem to work as well as clay and even that has it draw backs. So here are some pictures of what Iíve made so far.








Just as a note to people out there when I said ďwe have the technology we can build herĒ I was referring to Aiko a full size adult and not a child. To build such a robot with such small body part is not possible with todayís technology as far as I have seen. And to ask me to build such a device for such a purpose, I find your hate ridge of women and suggested abuse of children barbaric and appalling. Children are precious, they have this unique way of looking at the world and come up with their own solutions on how to fix thing. Women are precious; as well with out them we would not have a race of humanís (among other things they are precious for to many to mention).

To that end I do not give anyone permission to us my words and twist them to per mote their hate ridge. If you want to know how I feel or think please ask.

I apologize if Iím stepping out of line here and will ignore these types of people in the future.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:42 pm

I want to thank those people how have given me some of their ideaís. Thank you. I look at everything and if I donít us the idea today I keep it in mind to us anther day. Please keep them coming.

To Artilect rule! Thank you. I would like to hear more on what you have found. Perhaps if you could add some web sites so that I could see what you are referring to. I have looked at some of the synthetic burn skin to see if it is possible to transpose it onto a robotic framework. A mini dialysis machine could be designed to filter out impurities and add portents plus oxygen via a synthetic form of blood. If you have ever seen a brain dead person they have them hooked up to all these machines and IVís. They can keep their bodies alive for a period of time. Sorry if I seam to sound like Frankenstein, I just would like to see a better skin then silicon. My thought here is if a synthetic sustaining skin could be put onto a prostetic limb you wouldnít have the body rejection and give the person an emotional boost at a more realistic looking limb. And if you put it on a robotic frame, well I know there are probably some people out there that would reject the idea and say Iím trying to play God. Not trying to do that, but it may need to be discuss if we wont to build a cyborg.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Artilects rule! on Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:06 pm

Kthomp06 wrote:I want to thank those people how have given me some of their ideaís. Thank you. I look at everything and if I donít us the idea today I keep it in mind to us anther day. Please keep them coming.

To Artilect rule! Thank you. I would like to hear more on what you have found. Perhaps if you could add some web sites so that I could see what you are referring to. I have looked at some of the synthetic burn skin to see if it is possible to transpose it onto a robotic framework. A mini dialysis machine could be designed to filter out impurities and add portents plus oxygen via a synthetic form of blood. If you have ever seen a brain dead person they have them hooked up to all these machines and IVís. They can keep their bodies alive for a period of time. Sorry if I seam to sound like Frankenstein, I just would like to see a better skin then silicon. My thought here is if a synthetic sustaining skin could be put onto a prostetic limb you wouldnít have the body rejection and give the person an emotional boost at a more realistic looking limb. And if you put it on a robotic frame, well I know there are probably some people out there that would reject the idea and say Iím trying to play God. Not trying to do that, but it may need to be discuss if we wont to build a cyborg.
I was actually thinking about a mechanical spine they are using to help people walk again, but on the skin front, silicone is all I can find, like this sushi making/serving hand:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBcfpeiM-lg

This is for humans, but I'm sure it can be adapted to Le's B.R.A.I.N.S. software.
http://io9.com/342273/nanotubes-make-synthetic-skin-feel-your-pain

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Fri Aug 14, 2009 12:08 pm

On the mechanical spine, where you asking if it could be used in Aiko to have her bend and flex? Becuase the aswer would be yes. I just need a little more of your thought on that idea.

Thank you for the links, that was great. The guy in the video looked realy happy that his demo was going so well. Plus it's the first time I have seen where they are putting the air muscels in the hand.

Thank you for the touch sensores, I was looking for that. The first time I hear of touch sensores I pulled apart my keyboard and saw an aray of touch sensores.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Artilects rule! on Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:57 pm

Kthomp06 wrote:On the mechanical spine, where you asking if it could be used in Aiko to have her bend and flex? Becuase the aswer would be yes. I just need a little more of your thought on that idea.

Thank you for the links, that was great. The guy in the video looked realy happy that his demo was going so well. Plus it's the first time I have seen where they are putting the air muscels in the hand.

Thank you for the touch sensores, I was looking for that. The first time I hear of touch sensores I pulled apart my keyboard and saw an aray of touch sensores.
You're welcome, glad I could help, but it sounds like you would need much more money to do all that.

This has more to do with how the spine functions rather than the physical appearance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUtL7c16haI
Here's one that mimics movements of a snake, but it's generally used like an eel.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=139523333240485714&ei=RLeFSvbqM5OerAKD0JSfCw&q=robot+spine&dur=2&client=firefox-a
Your average pool cleaner for 60 - 80 dollars can take care of that.

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:58 am

Thank you, for sharing the video they were cool. As for the skin, it wouldnít cost so much since weíre not talking about doing this to a human, you probably have the parts to make a simple dialysis right in your home and donít even know it.

You need 2 containers to hold the IV solution.
You need a long cake pan to hold the skin.
You need air-tubing form a fish tank.
You need a water filter.
You need 2 basketball fill nozzles to be used as needles.
You need a gallon of distilled water and proteins.
You need 1 air stone and air pump to add oxygen.
You need 1 mini pump with dc motor from a Bissell green machine and a battery.

Put it all together and you have a simple dialysis machine and remember weíre not doing this on humans. Because one little air bubble into your blood stream and your dead in seconds.


Simple Dialysis

I taught the spin video was cool. I hope they try putting a send and receive unit on each of the nerve endings connected by fiber optics to pass the info from the brain to the lower nerve. Of course this may have the best results on a freshly severed nerve, because nerves usually die after being severed. Iím a little puzzled though, why donít they just reconnect the spinal cord and hit it with ion partials to help it heal? All cells have an electrical charge them and you can prove it by passing a mille gusset meter over your hand or by looking through a thermal camera. Nerves do grow back and I can prove it. My neighbor lost the use of her arm after getting a shot that served the nerve. A year later or so she started to get feeling back in her hand and started to move her fingers. She has regained full use of the arm now.

I donít think the snake is a new pool cleaner, because I havenít learned enough Japanese from Cyber Girl because I burned out the DVD player after playing it 40 times.
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RE: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:44 am

Iím finding that micro gears for the hand are really hard to make, especially when you keep getting these little micro bubbles. I donít have a mini-milling machine to make them with because they cost $1000 and I donít know if they have a cutter small enough to make this gear. So Iím figuring out different way to make the gear with out a mini-milling machine. Remember these gears are the size of an aspirin. Iíve also figured out how to put the servo controller into the hand so I only have a few wire and I can detach the hand from the arm for repairs.



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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Discoman on Tue Sep 01, 2009 6:35 pm

maybe a laser engraver on a higher power setting? slowly etch away a block of metal and you should get a gear from it.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Tue Sep 01, 2009 7:51 pm

Discoman wrote:maybe a laser engraver on a higher power setting? slowly etch away a block of metal and you should get a gear from it.

Itís a good idea, but way out of my price rang they want $8000.00 for a machine I saw on line. I need to make 30 or so gears, 14 for each hand and some spar parts.

There was a machine that I think auto parts makers use, it has a tank of liquid that shots a laser in to it and builds the part bit by bit, but I forget what the name of it is.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Discoman on Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:48 pm

sometimes used ones go for cheap. If you know who to talk to and are prepared to wear out your phone, you may get one over 10 years old used for free from a hospital.

http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/laserlps.htm#lpsnsw9

that site should help, go through that page for other part/unit sources, and the whole site has plenty of info so you should be able to easily find which laser type and of what power you need.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Konrad13 on Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:08 am

Extremely interesting. I did not know one could become so precise in making a robot hand. Give it some time, a few years perhaps, and we might see robots that look and move like humans if the tech continues.

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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Discoman on Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:19 pm

like that one hand they just recently made? it can bounce a rubber ball, flip coins between fingers, catch stuff, etc.
it uses several cameras not on the robot to track items in three dimensions.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:14 am

Discoman wrote:like that one hand they just recently made? it can bounce a rubber ball, flip coins between fingers, catch stuff, etc.
it uses several cameras not on the robot to track items in three dimensions.

You wouldn't happen to have a link to that page? I saw that hand and can't for the life of me find the link again.
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Discoman on Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:56 pm

i can't remember a link either, but it seems most people recognize it once you describe it.

it was on the websites www.hackaday.com and geekologie
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Reaper on Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:30 pm

One option you could consider for putting the teeth on your brass form is acid etching like is used to make circuit boards or die for coin making. Placing your mold in a vacuum chamber can help pull out bubbles as well.
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RE: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

Post  Kthomp06 on Sun Jan 10, 2010 12:29 am

Hi I'm back, still working on my hand and the gear. Here's the new gear that I made yesterday.


Now you can see the teeth aranged how I need them to be so I can reposition the motor. I've also been working on the wrist.




The right wrist is made of clay and the left is the finished part that came out of the mold. The holes you see in the front of the part are for ball joints so the fingers can be replaced if damaged. The cut outs are for the servo's and controller board that will be fitted to the other side of the part. After making this part I came up with a new way to do the thunb assembly. This is just my pototype and I'm hoping to get it were the thumb will be able to touch the tip of the little finger.
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How the hand works

Post  Guest 1 on Sun Jan 17, 2010 1:44 pm

The holes you see in the front of the part are for ball joints so the fingers can be replaced if damaged.
Don't forget about what I posted.
The question was how to make the fingers bend.
The 4 fingers and thumb don't actually bend.

Imagine throwing a bunch of levels on a wall (knuckles).
Each level has another level on it which also can be thrown.
Each of those levers has yet another level that's smaller than the first two.
When all levers move together, each three lever group looks like it's bending.

The robot can only move the first part of each lever by itself.
The last 2 lever parts move at the same time.

If you look at how you're hand works, the four fingers are attached to each other heading to the wrist (which is actually hinged twice for movement in all directions, can use ball barrings throughout body), but the thumb is not attached in bone (can use bungi cord).
It has 2 levers instead of three, and they always move together folding the palm at the same time.

Finger redundancy is useful for birthing deformities, growth mutations, or accidents in adulthood.

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Correction

Post  Guest 1 on Sun Jan 17, 2010 1:55 pm

I meant thumb parts move at the same time, not the folding of the palm.

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False Impression

Post  Guest 1 on Sun Jan 17, 2010 2:15 pm

If you look at how you're hand works, the four fingers are attached to each other heading to the wrist (which is actually hinged twice for movement in all directions, can use ball barrings throughout body), but the thumb is not attached in bone (can use bungi cord).
It has 2 levers instead of three, and thumb parts always move together.
I'm sure you're thinking I'm full of it since the picture above is a real hand.
That picture is actually the hand of a gorilla, who has more redundancies than a human hand, furthermore, it's the representation of a hand without muscle.

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RE: False Impression

Post  Kthomp06 on Sun Jan 17, 2010 4:55 pm

Guest 1 wrote:
If you look at how you're hand works, the four fingers are attached to each other heading to the wrist (which is actually hinged twice for movement in all directions, can use ball barrings throughout body), but the thumb is not attached in bone (can use bungi cord).
It has 2 levers instead of three, and thumb parts always move together.
I'm sure you're thinking I'm full of it since the picture above is a real hand.
That picture is actually the hand of a gorilla, who has more redundancies than a human hand, furthermore, it's the representation of a hand without muscle.

I'm sorry not to be mean, but that was a good one. Ok I see I'm going to have to show you were I got the hand from and that it's not a gorilla hand. The place I purchased the arm from doesn't sell it any more, I don't know why it was a good 4th quality human arm. I can understand with all the deception in the world how some one can view this arm as some thing else. I have no need to intentionally deceive any one, to me it's a wast of time and usually back fires on the deceiver. My goal has been to make a realistic, live size robotic arm ever since I saw the Bionic Man as a child. So don't worry you didn't offend me or any thing I just wanted you to know were I'm coming from.

Here is were I got the hand from http://anatomical.com/category.asp_Q_ipp_E_5000_A_t_E_c_A_sb_E_4_A_action_E_showall_A_c_E_26

Anatomical Chart Company



If your looking to purchase I found them cheap on this web site.
eGeneral Medical

Of course the are a lot of other place that sell them but some of them where missing the shoulder blade.

For a gorilla Skeleton


goto Skulls Unlimited
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Re: Suggustions for a more realistic appearance

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